From dcenteno at ydl.net  Thu Jul  1 00:52:41 2010
From: dcenteno at ydl.net (Derick Centeno)
Date: Wed, 30 Jun 2010 11:52:41 -0400
Subject: [ydl-gen] Sound on G4 PowerMac (digital audio)
In-Reply-To: <50E84F79-C5E7-4613-91C6-E8DBF335022F@sharedcup.com>
References: <9955F587-0BE6-48DE-AC11-3400C5E5735B@sharedcup.com>
	<20100630013909.4884f445@arakus>
	<50E84F79-C5E7-4613-91C6-E8DBF335022F@sharedcup.com>
Message-ID: <20100630115241.6c675396@arakus>

On Wed, 30 Jun 2010 07:35:19 -0600
Thomas Carlson <tcarlson at sharedcup.com> wrote:

> Derick:
> 
> I did what you suggested:  changed my window manager to xfce (very
> nice, I'm keeping it) and went to Settings/Settings Manager/Sound.
> All the controls are at 0 which tells me that the default setting is
> not recognizing the sound card.  In the Volume Control utility I
> can't get it to go from headphone to PC speaker.  I had the same
> problem with a Debian installation a while back.  Maybe PowerMac G4
> (Digital Audio) is an oddball among the other PM G4s.
> 
> Thanks for the response, though.
> 
> Tom

Try this Tom:

From anywhere within the xfce desktop right-click and then select
Settings --> Mixer Settings.  This dialog, simply called sound, is more
specific in controlling the hardware; on my system there are two
options default and something called PowerMac Snapper.  PowerMac
Snapper works for me, if you've a different card it should show up
there.

Also within XFCE choose Other --> Soundcard Detection.  A dialog box
appears asking for your root password, enter it.  Now a dialog box
appears called Audio configuration which allows you to control directly
which sound card produces sound and provides a test for you to hear it.
There are three tabs:

Sound test, Settings and System.

The first is self-explanatory.  Settings allows you to configure the
card.  System identifies what exactly your system is running.
The sound log file on my system is over 1,000 lines long and wouldn't
be useful to you.  What is useful to you is to acquire the ALSA driver
and sound utilities which maybe is missing on your system.  The System
tab will show you what you have or don't.  IF it is missing or not
available you can then use yum as follows:

to find out where it is do:

# yum info "*alsa*"
Loading "protectbase" plugin
Loading "installonlyn" plugin
Excluding Packages from Livna for Fedora Core 6 - ppc - Base
Finished
Excluding Packages from Fedora Extras
Finished
121 packages excluded due to repository protections
Installed Packages
Name   : alsa-lib
Arch   : ppc
Version: 1.0.17
Release: 1
Size   : 1.3 M
Repo   : installed
Summary: The Advanced Linux Sound Architecture (ALSA) library.

Description:
The Advanced Linux Sound Architecture (ALSA) provides audio and MIDI
functionality to the Linux operating system.

This package includes the ALSA runtime libraries to simplify application
programming and provide higher level functionality as well as support for
the older OSS API, providing binary compatibility for most OSS programs.


Name   : alsa-lib-devel
Arch   : ppc
Version: 1.0.17
Release: 1
Size   : 9.6 M
Repo   : installed
Summary: Static libraries and header files from the ALSA library.

Description:
The Advanced Linux Sound Architecture (ALSA) provides audio and MIDI
functionality to the Linux operating system.

This package includes the ALSA development libraries for developing
against the ALSA libraries and interfaces.


Name   : alsa-oss
Arch   : ppc
Version: 1.0.12
Release: 3.fc6
Size   : 88 k
Repo   : installed
Summary: Advanced Linux Sound Architecture (ALSA) wrapper for OSS

Description:
This package contains the compatibility library and wrapper script for
running legacy OSS applications through ALSA. Unlike the kernel
driver, this has the advantage of supporting DMIX software mixing.


Name   : alsa-oss-devel
Arch   : ppc
Version: 1.0.12
Release: 3.fc6
Size   : 11 k
Repo   : installed
Summary: Headers for ALSA wrapper for OSS

Description:
Header files for alsa-oss.


Name   : alsa-utils
Arch   : ppc
Version: 1.0.17
Release: 1
Size   : 1.6 M
Repo   : installed
Summary: Advanced Linux Sound Architecture (ALSA) utilities

Description:
This package contains command line utilities for the Advanced Linux Sound
Architecture (ALSA).


Name   : alsamixergui
Arch   : ppc
Version: 0.9.0
Release: 0.3.rc1.fc6
Size   : 78 k
Repo   : installed
Summary: GUI mixer for ALSA sound devices

Description:
alsamixergui is a FLTK based frontend for alsamixer. It is written
directly on top of the alsamixer source, leaving the original source
intact, only adding a couple of ifdefs, and some calls to the gui
part, so it provides exactly the same functionality, but with a
graphical userinterface.


Available Packages
Name   : balsa
Arch   : ppc
Version: 2.3.20
Release: 1.fc6
Size   : 2.5 M
Repo   : fedora-extras
Summary: Mail Client
Description:
Balsa is a GNOME email client which supports mbox, maildir, and mh
local mailboxes, and IMAP4 and POP3 remote mailboxes. Email can be
sent via sendmail or SMTP. Optional multithreading support allows for
non-intrusive retrieval and sending of mail. A finished GUI similar to
that of the Eudora email client supports viewing images inline, saving
message parts, viewing headers, adding attachments, moving messages,
and printing messages.

Name   : kadu-alsa_sound
Arch   : ppc
Version: 0.5.0
Release: 2.fc6
Size   : 19 k
Repo   : fedora-extras
Summary: ALSA module for Kadu
Description:
ALSA module for Kadu.

Name   : openpbx-alsa
Arch   : ppc
Version: 1.2
Release: 3.rc2.svn2282.fc6
Size   : 56 k
Repo   : fedora-extras
Summary: ALSA channel driver for OpenPBX
Description:
This package contains an ALSA console driver for OpenPBX, which allows
the local sound devices to be used for making and receiving calls.

Name   : python-alsaaudio
Arch   : ppc
Version: 0.2
Release: 1.fc6
Size   : 17 k
Repo   : fedora-extras
Summary: Python Alsa Bindings
Description:
The Python-AlsaAudio package contains bindings for the ALSA sound API.

# 

You can see from what yum produces what I have installed; you can
choose to have installed the packages which I have, or all the alsa
packages available.  Of course your version of yum can only see or
acquire them if it is pointing to the servers where they can be found.
If you've questions regarding how I set up yum, please ask.  I'll
happily share where I picked up the strategy of using yum more
effectively both to expand YDL and further protect the base
installation.

Assuming you have access to the alsa libraries all you need then do is
have yum install them for you.  Of course, you'll recognize * as a
terminal wild-card symbol which I used in the yum command sequence to
avoid typing characters, numbers and so on which developers keep
insisting in putting into packages and library names. :)

I hope the above was helpful.

All the best...


From sjh at adfa.edu.au  Thu Jul  1 08:30:39 2010
From: sjh at adfa.edu.au (Stephen Harker)
Date: Thu, 1 Jul 2010 09:30:39 +1000
Subject: [ydl-gen] Sound on G4 PowerMac (digital audio)
In-Reply-To: <20100630115241.6c675396@arakus>
References: <9955F587-0BE6-48DE-AC11-3400C5E5735B@sharedcup.com>
	<20100630013909.4884f445@arakus>
	<50E84F79-C5E7-4613-91C6-E8DBF335022F@sharedcup.com>
	<20100630115241.6c675396@arakus>
Message-ID: <20100630233039.GA13277@localhost.localdomain>

On Wed, Jun 30, 2010 at 11:52:41AM -0400, Derick Centeno wrote:
> On Wed, 30 Jun 2010 07:35:19 -0600
> Thomas Carlson <tcarlson at sharedcup.com> wrote:
> 
> > Derick:
> > 
> > I did what you suggested:  changed my window manager to xfce (very
> > nice, I'm keeping it) and went to Settings/Settings Manager/Sound.
> > All the controls are at 0 which tells me that the default setting is
> > not recognizing the sound card.  In the Volume Control utility I
> > can't get it to go from headphone to PC speaker.  I had the same
> > problem with a Debian installation a while back.  Maybe PowerMac G4
> > (Digital Audio) is an oddball among the other PM G4s.
> > 
> > Thanks for the response, though.
> > 
> > Tom
> 
> Try this Tom:
> 
> >From anywhere within the xfce desktop right-click and then select
> Settings --> Mixer Settings.  This dialog, simply called sound, is more
> specific in controlling the hardware; on my system there are two
> options default and something called PowerMac Snapper.  PowerMac
> Snapper works for me, if you've a different card it should show up
> there.

One question, should this powermac G4 be using the snd-aoa driver
(http://alsa.opensrc.org/index.php/Aoa> rather than snd-powermac
<http://alsa.opensrc.org/index.php/Powermac>?  I don't know what the
correct module is for the model listed.

With my iBook G4 1.33MHz 12inch I found that snd-powermac did not
work.  To get snd-aoa to work I had to compile a kernel without
snd-powermac but with snd-aoa.  If I had both lsmod would always list
snd-powermac as would the system-config-soundcard utility and sound
would not work.  After compiling the new kernel sound works and I
have:

# cat /proc/asound/cards
 0 [SoundByLayout  ]: AppleOnbdAudio - SoundByLayout
                      SoundByLayout

# lsmod | grep snd
snd_aoa_codec_tas      10697  2 
snd_aoa_fabric_layout     9534  0 
snd_aoa_i2sbus         18011  1 
snd_aoa                14732  2 snd_aoa_codec_tas,snd_aoa_fabric_layout
snd_seq_dummy           1450  0 
snd_seq_oss            30167  0 
snd_seq_midi_event      5604  1 snd_seq_oss
snd_seq                52321  5 snd_seq_dummy,snd_seq_oss,snd_seq_midi_event
snd_seq_device          5849  3 snd_seq_dummy,snd_seq_oss,snd_seq
snd_pcm_oss            40852  0 
snd_mixer_oss          16222  1 snd_pcm_oss
snd_pcm                71703  2 snd_aoa_i2sbus,snd_pcm_oss
snd_timer              19637  2 snd_seq,snd_pcm
snd_page_alloc          6365  1 snd_pcm
snd                    50847  11 snd_aoa_codec_tas,snd_aoa_fabric_layout,snd_aoa_i2sbus,snd_aoa,snd_seq_oss,snd_seq,snd_seq_device,snd_pcm_oss,snd_mixer_oss,snd_pcm,snd_timer
soundcore               6008  1 snd
snd_aoa_soundbus        3889  2 snd_aoa_fabric_layout,snd_aoa_i2sbus


-- 
Stephen Harker                           s.harker at adfa.edu.au
PEMS                
UNSW at ADFA

From sjh at adfa.edu.au  Thu Jul  1 09:15:17 2010
From: sjh at adfa.edu.au (Stephen Harker)
Date: Thu, 1 Jul 2010 10:15:17 +1000
Subject: [ydl-gen] Sound on G4 PowerMac (digital audio)
In-Reply-To: <20100630115241.6c675396@arakus>
References: <9955F587-0BE6-48DE-AC11-3400C5E5735B@sharedcup.com>
	<20100630013909.4884f445@arakus>
	<50E84F79-C5E7-4613-91C6-E8DBF335022F@sharedcup.com>
	<20100630115241.6c675396@arakus>
Message-ID: <20100701001517.GA16781@localhost.localdomain>

Hi,

I finally found some sites that indicate that snd-powermac is the
correct module for the powermac G4 digital audio.  There does seem to
be several sites mentioning patches for the alsa drivers for these
models so there may be problems.  The show up near the top of the list
I got using the search string 'powermac G4 "digital audio" alsa
driver' in google.  

What do you get from the output of 'dmesg | grep snd' in a shell?  For
example, for my iBook G4 I get:

# dmesg | grep snd
snd-aoa-fabric-layout: Using PMF GPIOs
snd-aoa-codec-tas: found tas3004
snd-aoa-fabric-layout: can use this codec
snd-aoa-codec-tas: tas found, addr 0x35 on /pci at f2000000/mac-io at 17/i2c at 18000/i2c-bus at 0/codec at 6a


-- 
Stephen Harker                           s.harker at adfa.edu.au
PEMS                
UNSW at ADFA

From dcenteno at ydl.net  Thu Jul  1 21:04:44 2010
From: dcenteno at ydl.net (Derick Centeno)
Date: Thu, 01 Jul 2010 08:04:44 -0400
Subject: [ydl-gen] Sound on G4 PowerMac (digital audio)
In-Reply-To: <20100630233039.GA13277@localhost.localdomain>
References: <9955F587-0BE6-48DE-AC11-3400C5E5735B@sharedcup.com>
	<20100630013909.4884f445@arakus>
	<50E84F79-C5E7-4613-91C6-E8DBF335022F@sharedcup.com>
	<20100630115241.6c675396@arakus>	<20100630233039.GA13277@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <20100701080444.4c9c0434@arakus>

On Thu, 1 Jul 2010 09:30:39 +1000
Stephen Harker <sjh at adfa.edu.au> wrote:

> On Wed, Jun 30, 2010 at 11:52:41AM -0400, Derick Centeno wrote:
> > On Wed, 30 Jun 2010 07:35:19 -0600
> > Thomas Carlson <tcarlson at sharedcup.com> wrote:
> > 
> > > Derick:
> > > 
> > > I did what you suggested:  changed my window manager to xfce (very
> > > nice, I'm keeping it) and went to Settings/Settings Manager/Sound.
> > > All the controls are at 0 which tells me that the default setting
> > > is not recognizing the sound card.  In the Volume Control utility
> > > I can't get it to go from headphone to PC speaker.  I had the same
> > > problem with a Debian installation a while back.  Maybe PowerMac
> > > G4 (Digital Audio) is an oddball among the other PM G4s.
> > > 
> > > Thanks for the response, though.
> > > 
> > > Tom
> > 
> > Try this Tom:
> > 
> > >From anywhere within the xfce desktop right-click and then select
> > Settings --> Mixer Settings.  This dialog, simply called sound, is
> > more specific in controlling the hardware; on my system there are
> > two options default and something called PowerMac Snapper.  PowerMac
> > Snapper works for me, if you've a different card it should show up
> > there.
> 
> One question, should this powermac G4 be using the snd-aoa driver
> (http://alsa.opensrc.org/index.php/Aoa> rather than snd-powermac
> <http://alsa.opensrc.org/index.php/Powermac>?  I don't know what the
> correct module is for the model listed.
> 
> With my iBook G4 1.33MHz 12inch I found that snd-powermac did not
> work.  To get snd-aoa to work I had to compile a kernel without
> snd-powermac but with snd-aoa.  If I had both lsmod would always list
> snd-powermac as would the system-config-soundcard utility and sound
> would not work.  After compiling the new kernel sound works and I
> have:
> 
> # cat /proc/asound/cards
>  0 [SoundByLayout  ]: AppleOnbdAudio - SoundByLayout
>                       SoundByLayout
> 
> # lsmod | grep snd
> snd_aoa_codec_tas      10697  2 
> snd_aoa_fabric_layout   9534  0 
> snd_aoa_i2sbus         18011  1 
>...

Hi Stephen:

Within XFCE there is an app accessible by going to the XFCE menu or by
right-clicking on a three-button mouse: Other --> Soundcard Detection.
After entering the root password for your system which you created when
you first installed YDL (hopefully you created a separate root password
and user password at that time) the Soundcard Detection app will come
up (it shows up with the name Audio configuration) and you'll notice
three tabs one of which is called System click that one.  You'll see an
option for a Report.  If you click on that button a file will be
placed in the root directory with the name: scsconfig.log.  It can be
opened with vim or any other text editor of your choice.

This report collects all elements for you regarding the sound device
you have installed.  What is useful about it is that different sections
list the commands used to generate the data below it.  This can be a
time saver when one is looking to resolve a problem.

I'm going to utilize commands utilized in generating different sections
of that report to address what you posted.  The entire report is over
1000 lines and although a good source of study; surpasses the intent of
the current discussion.

[root at arakus ~]# lsmod|grep snd
snd_aoa_i2sbus         20296  0 
snd_powermac           46944  1 
snd_seq_oss            35724  0 
snd_seq_midi_event      6488  1 snd_seq_oss
snd_seq                59268  4 snd_seq_oss,snd_seq_midi_event
snd_seq_device          6824  2 snd_seq_oss,snd_seq
snd_pcm_oss            43520  0 
snd_mixer_oss          16160  1 snd_pcm_oss
snd_pcm                77528  3 snd_aoa_i2sbus,snd_powermac,snd_pcm_oss
snd_timer              22016  2 snd_seq,snd_pcm
snd_page_alloc          8672  1 snd_pcm
snd                    53520  11
snd_aoa_i2sbus,snd_powermac,snd_seq_oss,snd_seq,snd_seq_device,snd_pcm_oss,snd_mixer_oss,snd_pcm,snd_timer
soundcore               6300  1 snd snd_aoa_soundbus        4872  1
snd_aoa_i2sbus

Something should strike you immediately.  You have the snd_aoa_i2sbus
module; I instead have snd_powermac.  The calls by modules, made
available by software libraries, to the sound device must be adapted to
utilize the hardware devices we actually have installed.  This takes a
bit of research as you did. If you look closely, you'll notice that
snd_powermac and snd_aoa_i2sbus modules can act on other modules as
alternatives to one another in certain instances.  

If you explore (open modprobe.conf with vim) /etc/modprobe.conf  on my
system here is what would be there:

alias eth0 sungem
alias snd-card-0 snd-powermac
options snd-card-0 index=0
options snd-powermac index=0

Yours could be different.

Also if you did the following command on my system, you'll see what
hardware I have installed:

# aplay -l
**** List of PLAYBACK Hardware Devices ****
card 0: Snapper [PowerMac Snapper], device 0: PMac Snapper [PowerMac Snapper]
  Subdevices: 1/1
  Subdevice #0: subdevice #0
#

Yours may be different.

Final note:  I've found it useful that when I'm in user mode ($) and
want to move into root to execute a command instead of using sudo I do
the following:

$ su -
#

The difference is that this allows you to have any Linux, behave as
though all Linux commands were available regardless what directory you
are invoking those commands from or where the commands actually are
within the Linux directory tree.

All the best...

From sjh at adfa.edu.au  Tue Jul  6 07:23:31 2010
From: sjh at adfa.edu.au (Stephen Harker)
Date: Tue, 6 Jul 2010 08:23:31 +1000
Subject: [ydl-gen] Sound on G4 PowerMac (digital audio)
In-Reply-To: <20100701080444.4c9c0434@arakus>
References: <9955F587-0BE6-48DE-AC11-3400C5E5735B@sharedcup.com>
	<20100630013909.4884f445@arakus>
	<50E84F79-C5E7-4613-91C6-E8DBF335022F@sharedcup.com>
	<20100630115241.6c675396@arakus>
	<20100630233039.GA13277@localhost.localdomain>
	<20100701080444.4c9c0434@arakus>
Message-ID: <20100705222331.GA5862@localhost.local>

Hi Derick,

> Within XFCE there is an app accessible by going to the XFCE menu or by
> right-clicking on a three-button mouse: Other --> Soundcard Detection.
> [...]

It sounds pretty much like the standard system-config-soundcard.  As I
indicated sound works perfectly in my iBook G4.  This is available
from the command line or any GUI.  Personally I use a minimal fvwm2
and run most things from the command line.  The question I was asking
was related to whether the original poster was using the correct
module.

With my 7600/200 the snd-powermac module is the correct module.  With
my iBook G4 and Powermac G5 it is snd-aoa (I have sound working
perfectly on all three of these machines).  If you look into the
information on the kernel (for example using `make xconfig') you will
find that snd-aoa is the appropriate module for later Powermacs and
snd-powermac for earlier ones.  At the time of my email I was unsure
which of snd-powermac or snd-aoa was appropriate for a `digital audio'
model, mostly because I did not know what that model name represented.
Looking at Apple Spec did not list the sound chip.  The notes in the
kernel indicate what sound chip goes with which module.

As I later indicated I finally found reporta that made it clear that
the `digital audio' G4 model uses the 'tumbler' device.  This is
listed in the kernel notes as a device for which the snd-powermac
module is appropriate.  It would appear to be the last sound device
for which that is the appropriate module.  Later sound devices require
snd-aoa.

If you look you will find many bug reports in which people report that
a kernel in which both snd-aoa and snd-powermac modules exist tends
not to provide sound in later macs.  What seems to happen is that the
kernel insists on using snd-powermac rather than snd-aoa and no sound
is generated.  This was certainly my experience with the default
kernels for ydl6.2 and with self-compiled kernels.  For these later
machines it is far more reliable if you compile the kernel without
snd-powermac, then sound works reliably all the time.

At the time of my first email I was not sure whether the original
poster had a machine that should be using snd-aoa.  In this case, as
is well known, snd-powermac would prevent sound working.  This would
have explained why he was seeing the module being loaded, but not
getting any sound.  It turns out not to be the case as snd-powermac is
appropriate for the `digital audio' machine.

The problem with snd-aoa and snd-powermac not coexisting reliably
appears to continue in kernels as late as 2.6.33 (I am using a version
of this in my G5).

> This report collects all elements for you regarding the sound device
> you have installed.  What is useful about it is that different sections
> list the commands used to generate the data below it.  This can be a
> time saver when one is looking to resolve a problem.

Personally I find it easier and quicker to use dmesg and related
commands (such as those listed in the report) directly from the shell.  

-- 
Stephen Harker                           s.harker at adfa.edu.au
PEMS                
UNSW at ADFA

From Robert.A.Black at noaa.gov  Fri Jul  9 00:24:07 2010
From: Robert.A.Black at noaa.gov (Robert Black)
Date: Thu, 08 Jul 2010 11:24:07 -0400
Subject: [ydl-gen] PS3 update problem
Message-ID: <9C844F7B-2FC7-4BC9-BDDF-B05125F98DCB@noaa.gov>

Does anyone have the PS3 .PUP update file that the hacker named George  
Holtz used to overcome the problem Sony caused by eliminating the  
"Other OS" option?

I cannot use an .exe file; I have a PPC Mac G4 at home. I need the  
actual file, otherwise, my YDL 6.2 installation on the PS3 that I  
spent an inordinate amount of time configuring will be inacessable  
before long.

Thanks.

Robert A. Black

Research Meteorologist                  4301 Rickenbacker Cswy.
NOAA/AOML/HRD                            Miami, FL 33149-1026

Ph:   (305) 361-4314
FAX: (305) 361-4528 (NEW)

E-Mail: Robert.A.Black at noaa.gov
(Any opinions expressed are mine alone, not NOAA policy)





From dcenteno at ydl.net  Fri Jul  9 04:25:29 2010
From: dcenteno at ydl.net (Derick Centeno)
Date: Thu, 08 Jul 2010 15:25:29 -0400
Subject: [ydl-gen] PS3 update problem
In-Reply-To: <9C844F7B-2FC7-4BC9-BDDF-B05125F98DCB@noaa.gov>
References: <9C844F7B-2FC7-4BC9-BDDF-B05125F98DCB@noaa.gov>
Message-ID: <20100708152529.6176c55a@arakus>

On Thu, 08 Jul 2010 11:24:07 -0400
Robert Black <Robert.A.Black at noaa.gov> wrote:

> Does anyone have the PS3 .PUP update file that the hacker named
> George Holtz used to overcome the problem Sony caused by eliminating
> the "Other OS" option?
> 
> I cannot use an .exe file; I have a PPC Mac G4 at home. I need the  
> actual file, otherwise, my YDL 6.2 installation on the PS3 that I  
> spent an inordinate amount of time configuring will be inacessable  
> before long.
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> Robert A. Black
> 
> Research Meteorologist                  4301 Rickenbacker Cswy.
> NOAA/AOML/HRD                            Miami, FL 33149-1026
> 
> Ph:   (305) 361-4314
> FAX: (305) 361-4528 (NEW)
> 
> E-Mail: Robert.A.Black at noaa.gov
> (Any opinions expressed are mine alone, not NOAA policy)
> 
Gee Robert,

I'm really sorry to learn that you got stuck on the PS3 problem.
Although I never got a PS3, and completed skipped the problem you are
enduring it appears that you are intent on struggling with it and Sony
a little further.

You may be able to acquire more information from the YDL Board
community (http://yellowdog-board.com/), as there are several people
there who are so incensed at the whole situation that they've organized
legal action against Sony.  I cannot promise you'll find what you are
looking for, but I can attest that you have lots of company.

As best I understand the crisis, a PS3/YDL user can keep the firmware
prior to 3.21 and continue to use their PS3 but be excluded from Sony
services or they move to the update and loose YDL.  Given your
profession, you may have overlooked that IBM decided last year to shut
down further work on the Cell and incorporate the experience compiled
from past efforts (with the Cell) into new Intel based hybrid chips
which they reported (back then) as appearing this year.  Although no
one will speak on this level of detail the i7 meets the description as
it is appearing as a Quad/Hexa-core chip.

It may be faster and less costly in time and money to just move onto i7
and linux variants like YDEL (an x86 based Linux) which support it.  You
are probably aware that Fixstars announced that YDL 6.2 is their
terminal version supporting the PowerPC.

Although PowerPC and Cell support will continue for some undefined
amount of time, without IBM effort behind such work, it is unlikely
that any effort is worth the time, unless it is a straight
academic project. 

Just my view of course, but I thought a better strategy would be to
transfer what code you may have developed onto a more current system.
Or you could implement the advantage of the G4 processor by
reprogramming your code to implement the Vector Processor which
processes code at 128bits wide.  There are no other chips doing
anything remotely like that; even the new ones top out at 64 bits.

Just passing along a suggestion which could interest you.

All the best...

From pjwall at mac.com  Tue Jul 27 04:34:48 2010
From: pjwall at mac.com (Pat Wall)
Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2010 20:34:48 +0100
Subject: [ydl-gen] Building Firefox 4.0 under YDL 6.2 PPC
Message-ID: <20100726203448.3a16f36e@powerstation.ydl>

Hi All

I was wondering if anyone has tried building Firefox 4.0 beta or from
the latest source tree?

For me the build fails with an architecture support error for ycbcr
which has been added to Firefox from Chromium code:

"/home/pjwall/src/mozilla-central/gfx/ycbcr/chromium_types.h:76:2:
error: #error Please add support for your architecture in
chromium_types.h"

The new IPC support in Firefox from 3.6.4 onwards is using code from
Chromium giving a similar build failure but the build will complete
successfully if the option "ac_add_options --disable-ipc" is added to
the mozconfig.

Does anyone know of a similar option for disabling ycbcr or indeed
another workaround?

Thanks


Pat


From kilowattradio at comcast.net  Tue Jul 27 09:37:52 2010
From: kilowattradio at comcast.net (Keith)
Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2010 17:37:52 -0700
Subject: [ydl-gen] Won't Boot YDL with Power Mac G5 1.6 GHz machine
Message-ID: <C8737870.C9F6%kilowattradio@comcast.net>

I'm having a problem booting any Yellow Dog Linux for PPC with my Power Mac
PPC w 1.6 GHz processor. If I put in a Mac Disk and hold down the C on the
keyboard Mac OS X PPC disks boots fine. If I put in any YDL DVD in the drive
the YDL PPC DVD will not boot and the machine Boots Mac OS X Tiger from the
HDD.
I have also burned the YDL DVD at slowest speeds and on different DVD
burners with the same result.

 Anyone know what I should check or do to get YDL PPC DVD to boot?
--?
Best Regards,?Keith
http://home.comcast.net/~kilowattradio/








From dcenteno at ydl.net  Tue Jul 27 22:00:21 2010
From: dcenteno at ydl.net (Derick Centeno)
Date: Tue, 27 Jul 2010 09:00:21 -0400
Subject: [ydl-gen] Building Firefox 4.0 under YDL 6.2 PPC
In-Reply-To: <20100726203448.3a16f36e@powerstation.ydl>
References: <20100726203448.3a16f36e@powerstation.ydl>
Message-ID: <20100727090021.10d6625b@arakus>

On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 20:34:48 +0100
Pat Wall <pjwall at mac.com> wrote:

> Hi All
> 
> I was wondering if anyone has tried building Firefox 4.0 beta or from
> the latest source tree?
> 
> For me the build fails with an architecture support error for ycbcr
> which has been added to Firefox from Chromium code:
> 
> "/home/pjwall/src/mozilla-central/gfx/ycbcr/chromium_types.h:76:2:
> error: #error Please add support for your architecture in
> chromium_types.h"
> 
> The new IPC support in Firefox from 3.6.4 onwards is using code from
> Chromium giving a similar build failure but the build will complete
> successfully if the option "ac_add_options --disable-ipc" is added to
> the mozconfig.
> 
> Does anyone know of a similar option for disabling ycbcr or indeed
> another workaround?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> 
> Pat
> 

Hi Pat:

The fastest and least time consuming option you may have is to comment
out the offending code.

The other possibility is to rewrite chromium_types.h so that it
references PPC recognized commands which also means that you may have
to become (or be) very familiar with PPC assembler and/or the PPC
command architecture controlling various aspects of the PPC cpu. The
problem with that is that you could make the new file so specific to
the PPC you own that the code may not function on other PPC systems
differently designed.

All the best...

From dcenteno at ydl.net  Tue Jul 27 22:11:18 2010
From: dcenteno at ydl.net (Derick Centeno)
Date: Tue, 27 Jul 2010 09:11:18 -0400
Subject: [ydl-gen] Won't Boot YDL with Power Mac G5 1.6 GHz machine
In-Reply-To: <C8737870.C9F6%kilowattradio@comcast.net>
References: <C8737870.C9F6%kilowattradio@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <20100727091118.4ab2f248@arakus>

On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 17:37:52 -0700
Keith <kilowattradio at comcast.net> wrote:

> I'm having a problem booting any Yellow Dog Linux for PPC with my
> Power Mac PPC w 1.6 GHz processor. If I put in a Mac Disk and hold
> down the C on the keyboard Mac OS X PPC disks boots fine. If I put in
> any YDL DVD in the drive the YDL PPC DVD will not boot and the
> machine Boots Mac OS X Tiger from the HDD.
> I have also burned the YDL DVD at slowest speeds and on different DVD
> burners with the same result.
> 
>  Anyone know what I should check or do to get YDL PPC DVD to boot?
> --?
> Best Regards,?Keith
> http://home.comcast.net/~kilowattradio/
> 

Keith, did you remember to partition your internal drive so that it is
formatted for Linux?  Also did you bother to test whether the SHA1SUM
for the .iso image of YDL 6.2 you downloaded matches the official
SHA1SUM value before you burned the DVD?

If you did not do this test and/or the SHA1SUM value do not match then
the .iso image of YDL you burned onto your DVD is incomplete and will
not have all the information it needs to properly install YDL onto your
system.

Please note it is not the speed of the burn that matters; but whether
the SHA1SUM values match.

In downloading the .iso it is best and most efficient to have DSL or
faster internet connections.  If your DSL speed is low the download of
the YDL .iso will take hours.  However, if you only have dial-up speeds
(56K modem or slower) the full download of YDL will require a week or
longer with one phone line dedicated to doing nothing but that download
without any disconnnects; of course any disturbance on such a line
means starting from scratch all over again.

All the best...

From kilowattradio at comcast.net  Tue Jul 27 23:29:17 2010
From: kilowattradio at comcast.net (Keith)
Date: Tue, 27 Jul 2010 14:29:17 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [ydl-gen] Won't Boot YDL with Power Mac G5 1.6 GHz machine
In-Reply-To: <20100727091118.4ab2f248@arakus>
Message-ID: <112710605.650367.1280240957735.JavaMail.root@sz0160a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

 Hi, I have done all the hash checksums and all the checksums are correct.

> Keith, did you remember to partition your internal drive so that it is
> formatted for Linux? 

 Well I can't partition it for ext2/3/4 unless I can boot up the DVD. On a Intel machine I could use partition magic,
but what do I use for a PPC running Mac OS X? Do I have to only have a linux partition on the PPC or can OS X & YDL co-exists?
This is my 1st attempt to install on PPC after many Intel installs of Linux so a *Good* web page would be appreciated.

TIA.
 

-- 
Best Regards, Keith 
http://home.comcast.net/~kilowattradio/

----- Original Message -----

> From: "Derick Centeno" <dcenteno at ydl.net>
> To: yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com
> Sent: Tuesday, July 27, 2010 6:11:18 AM
> Subject: Re: [ydl-gen] Won't Boot YDL with Power Mac G5 1.6 GHz machine
> 
> On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 17:37:52 -0700
> Keith <kilowattradio at comcast.net> wrote:
> 
> > I'm having a problem booting any Yellow Dog Linux for PPC with my
> > Power Mac PPC w 1.6 GHz processor. If I put in a Mac Disk and hold
> > down the C on the keyboard Mac OS X PPC disks boots fine. If I put
> in
> > any YDL DVD in the drive the YDL PPC DVD will not boot and the
> > machine Boots Mac OS X Tiger from the HDD.
> > I have also burned the YDL DVD at slowest speeds and on different
> DVD
> > burners with the same result.
> >
> >  Anyone know what I should check or do to get YDL PPC DVD to boot?
> > --?
> > Best Regards,?Keith
> > http://home.comcast.net/~kilowattradio/
> >
> 
> Keith, did you remember to partition your internal drive so that it is
> formatted for Linux?  Also did you bother to test whether the SHA1SUM
> for the .iso image of YDL 6.2 you downloaded matches the official
> SHA1SUM value before you burned the DVD?
> 
> If you did not do this test and/or the SHA1SUM value do not match then
> the .iso image of YDL you burned onto your DVD is incomplete and will
> not have all the information it needs to properly install YDL onto
> your
> system.
> 
> Please note it is not the speed of the burn that matters; but whether
> the SHA1SUM values match.
> 
> In downloading the .iso it is best and most efficient to have DSL or
> faster internet connections.  If your DSL speed is low the download of
> the YDL .iso will take hours.  However, if you only have dial-up
> speeds
> (56K modem or slower) the full download of YDL will require a week or
> longer with one phone line dedicated to doing nothing but that
> download
> without any disconnnects; of course any disturbance on such a line
> means starting from scratch all over again.
> 
> All the best...
> _______________________________________________
> yellowdog-general mailing list - yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com
> Unsuscribe info:
> http://lists.fixstars.com/mailman/listinfo/yellowdog-general
> HINT: to Google archives, try  '&lt;keywords> site:us.fixstars.com'

From t.g.christopher at ieee.org  Wed Jul 28 00:15:47 2010
From: t.g.christopher at ieee.org (Terence G Christopher)
Date: Tue, 27 Jul 2010 08:15:47 -0700
Subject: [ydl-gen] Building Firefox 4.0 under YDL 6.2 PPC
In-Reply-To: <20100727090021.10d6625b@arakus>
References: <20100726203448.3a16f36e@powerstation.ydl>
	<20100727090021.10d6625b@arakus>
Message-ID: <4C4EF823.7050108@ieee.org>

Having installed YDL on my play station 3m and then having tried and 
failed to install my wireless keyboard, I have been following the 
various messages that have developed  over the past 6 months.It is a 
great pity that the incompleteness of YDL and lack of readily accessible 
documentation together with the failure of Sony to permit the machine to 
be readily used and switch between operating systems should destroy what 
could have been a fascinating and enriching  engineering development, It 
is disheartening to see discussions that are unchanged from 30 years ago 
which to me show that all of the talk about object oriented code, and 
clean interfaces was just that talk.I realise that the increasing 
complexity of machines and programmes greatly increases the challenges, 
however Many people such as myself do not want to spend our lives 
fiddling trying to get commonly used software to work on a machine. It 
is to me a measure of the inadequacy of the development and support 
operation. This discourages me from even attempting to use the machine. 
So no my play station  is merely an expensive and clumsy blue ray 
player. What a pity.
sincerely
Terence Christopher

On 7/27/2010 6:00 AM, Derick Centeno wrote:
> On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 20:34:48 +0100
> Pat Wall<pjwall at mac.com>  wrote:
>
>    
>> Hi All
>>
>> I was wondering if anyone has tried building Firefox 4.0 beta or from
>> the latest source tree?
>>
>> For me the build fails with an architecture support error for ycbcr
>> which has been added to Firefox from Chromium code:
>>
>> "/home/pjwall/src/mozilla-central/gfx/ycbcr/chromium_types.h:76:2:
>> error: #error Please add support for your architecture in
>> chromium_types.h"
>>
>> The new IPC support in Firefox from 3.6.4 onwards is using code from
>> Chromium giving a similar build failure but the build will complete
>> successfully if the option "ac_add_options --disable-ipc" is added to
>> the mozconfig.
>>
>> Does anyone know of a similar option for disabling ycbcr or indeed
>> another workaround?
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>>
>> Pat
>>
>>      
> Hi Pat:
>
> The fastest and least time consuming option you may have is to comment
> out the offending code.
>
> The other possibility is to rewrite chromium_types.h so that it
> references PPC recognized commands which also means that you may have
> to become (or be) very familiar with PPC assembler and/or the PPC
> command architecture controlling various aspects of the PPC cpu. The
> problem with that is that you could make the new file so specific to
> the PPC you own that the code may not function on other PPC systems
> differently designed.
>
> All the best...
> _______________________________________________
> yellowdog-general mailing list - yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com
> Unsuscribe info: http://lists.fixstars.com/mailman/listinfo/yellowdog-general
> HINT: to Google archives, try  '&lt;keywords>  site:us.fixstars.com'
>
>    

From henry.olders at mcgill.ca  Tue Jul 27 23:49:32 2010
From: henry.olders at mcgill.ca (Henry Olders)
Date: Tue, 27 Jul 2010 10:49:32 -0400
Subject: [ydl-gen] Won't Boot YDL with Power Mac G5 1.6 GHz machine
In-Reply-To: <112710605.650367.1280240957735.JavaMail.root@sz0160a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <112710605.650367.1280240957735.JavaMail.root@sz0160a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <1A631C22-5558-4A6B-891D-34111FD3A702@mcgill.ca>

http://www.yellowdoglinux.com/support/installation/ydl6.2_apple_guide.pdf

page 4 says you need to partition a single drive into at least 2 partitions. Mac OS includes disk utility which does a destructive partition. If you need "live" partitioning, google for a 3rd party tool such as iPartition .

Henry




On 2010-07-27, at 10:29 , Keith wrote:

> Hi, I have done all the hash checksums and all the checksums are correct.
> 
>> Keith, did you remember to partition your internal drive so that it is
>> formatted for Linux? 
> 
> Well I can't partition it for ext2/3/4 unless I can boot up the DVD. On a Intel machine I could use partition magic,
> but what do I use for a PPC running Mac OS X? Do I have to only have a linux partition on the PPC or can OS X & YDL co-exists?
> This is my 1st attempt to install on PPC after many Intel installs of Linux so a *Good* web page would be appreciated.
> 
> TIA.
> 
> 
> -- 
> Best Regards, Keith 
> http://home.comcast.net/~kilowattradio/
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> 
>> From: "Derick Centeno" <dcenteno at ydl.net>
>> To: yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com
>> Sent: Tuesday, July 27, 2010 6:11:18 AM
>> Subject: Re: [ydl-gen] Won't Boot YDL with Power Mac G5 1.6 GHz machine
>> 
>> On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 17:37:52 -0700
>> Keith <kilowattradio at comcast.net> wrote:
>> 
>>> I'm having a problem booting any Yellow Dog Linux for PPC with my
>>> Power Mac PPC w 1.6 GHz processor. If I put in a Mac Disk and hold
>>> down the C on the keyboard Mac OS X PPC disks boots fine. If I put
>> in
>>> any YDL DVD in the drive the YDL PPC DVD will not boot and the
>>> machine Boots Mac OS X Tiger from the HDD.
>>> I have also burned the YDL DVD at slowest speeds and on different
>> DVD
>>> burners with the same result.
>>> 
>>> Anyone know what I should check or do to get YDL PPC DVD to boot?
>>> -- 
>>> Best Regards, Keith
>>> http://home.comcast.net/~kilowattradio/
>>> 
>> 
>> Keith, did you remember to partition your internal drive so that it is
>> formatted for Linux?  Also did you bother to test whether the SHA1SUM
>> for the .iso image of YDL 6.2 you downloaded matches the official
>> SHA1SUM value before you burned the DVD?
>> 
>> If you did not do this test and/or the SHA1SUM value do not match then
>> the .iso image of YDL you burned onto your DVD is incomplete and will
>> not have all the information it needs to properly install YDL onto
>> your
>> system.
>> 
>> Please note it is not the speed of the burn that matters; but whether
>> the SHA1SUM values match.
>> 
>> In downloading the .iso it is best and most efficient to have DSL or
>> faster internet connections.  If your DSL speed is low the download of
>> the YDL .iso will take hours.  However, if you only have dial-up
>> speeds
>> (56K modem or slower) the full download of YDL will require a week or
>> longer with one phone line dedicated to doing nothing but that
>> download
>> without any disconnnects; of course any disturbance on such a line
>> means starting from scratch all over again.
>> 
>> All the best...
>> _______________________________________________
>> yellowdog-general mailing list - yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com
>> Unsuscribe info:
>> http://lists.fixstars.com/mailman/listinfo/yellowdog-general
>> HINT: to Google archives, try  '&lt;keywords> site:us.fixstars.com'
> _______________________________________________
> yellowdog-general mailing list - yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com
> Unsuscribe info: http://lists.fixstars.com/mailman/listinfo/yellowdog-general
> HINT: to Google archives, try  '&lt;keywords> site:us.fixstars.com'


From kilowattradio at comcast.net  Wed Jul 28 00:57:23 2010
From: kilowattradio at comcast.net (Keith)
Date: Tue, 27 Jul 2010 15:57:23 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [ydl-gen] Won't Boot YDL with Power Mac G5 1.6 GHz machine
In-Reply-To: <675131095.655763.1280246106186.JavaMail.root@sz0160a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <869349732.655953.1280246243206.JavaMail.root@sz0160a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

Ok. I have two HDD's in my PPC system. Can I have one HDD formatted in ext2/3/4 and leave the other formatted for Mac OS X?



-- 
Best Regards, Keith 
http://home.comcast.net/~kilowattradio/

----- Original Message -----

> From: "Henry Olders" <henry.olders at mcgill.ca>
> To: "Discussion List for Yellow Dog Linux User Topics" <yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, July 27, 2010 7:49:32 AM
> Subject: Re: [ydl-gen] Won't Boot YDL with Power Mac G5 1.6 GHz machine
> 
> http://www.yellowdoglinux.com/support/installation/ydl6.2_apple_guide.pdf
> 
> page 4 says you need to partition a single drive into at least 2
> partitions. Mac OS includes disk utility which does a destructive
> partition. If you need "live" partitioning, google for a 3rd party
> tool such as iPartition .
> 
> Henry
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On 2010-07-27, at 10:29 , Keith wrote:
> 
> > Hi, I have done all the hash checksums and all the checksums are
> correct.
> > 
> >> Keith, did you remember to partition your internal drive so that it
> is
> >> formatted for Linux? 
> > 
> > Well I can't partition it for ext2/3/4 unless I can boot up the DVD.
> On a Intel machine I could use partition magic,
> > but what do I use for a PPC running Mac OS X? Do I have to only have
> a linux partition on the PPC or can OS X & YDL co-exists?
> > This is my 1st attempt to install on PPC after many Intel installs
> of Linux so a *Good* web page would be appreciated.
> > 
> > TIA.
> > 
> > 
> > -- 
> > Best Regards, Keith 
> > http://home.comcast.net/~kilowattradio/
> > 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > 
> >> From: "Derick Centeno" <dcenteno at ydl.net>
> >> To: yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com
> >> Sent: Tuesday, July 27, 2010 6:11:18 AM
> >> Subject: Re: [ydl-gen] Won't Boot YDL with Power Mac G5 1.6 GHz
> machine
> >> 
> >> On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 17:37:52 -0700
> >> Keith <kilowattradio at comcast.net> wrote:
> >> 
> >>> I'm having a problem booting any Yellow Dog Linux for PPC with my
> >>> Power Mac PPC w 1.6 GHz processor. If I put in a Mac Disk and
> hold
> >>> down the C on the keyboard Mac OS X PPC disks boots fine. If I
> put
> >> in
> >>> any YDL DVD in the drive the YDL PPC DVD will not boot and the
> >>> machine Boots Mac OS X Tiger from the HDD.
> >>> I have also burned the YDL DVD at slowest speeds and on different
> >> DVD
> >>> burners with the same result.
> >>> 
> >>> Anyone know what I should check or do to get YDL PPC DVD to boot?
> >>> -- 
> >>> Best Regards, Keith
> >>> http://home.comcast.net/~kilowattradio/
> >>> 
> >> 
> >> Keith, did you remember to partition your internal drive so that it
> is
> >> formatted for Linux?  Also did you bother to test whether the
> SHA1SUM
> >> for the .iso image of YDL 6.2 you downloaded matches the official
> >> SHA1SUM value before you burned the DVD?
> >> 
> >> If you did not do this test and/or the SHA1SUM value do not match
> then
> >> the .iso image of YDL you burned onto your DVD is incomplete and
> will
> >> not have all the information it needs to properly install YDL onto
> >> your
> >> system.
> >> 
> >> Please note it is not the speed of the burn that matters; but
> whether
> >> the SHA1SUM values match.
> >> 
> >> In downloading the .iso it is best and most efficient to have DSL
> or
> >> faster internet connections.  If your DSL speed is low the download
> of
> >> the YDL .iso will take hours.  However, if you only have dial-up
> >> speeds
> >> (56K modem or slower) the full download of YDL will require a week
> or
> >> longer with one phone line dedicated to doing nothing but that
> >> download
> >> without any disconnnects; of course any disturbance on such a line
> >> means starting from scratch all over again.
> >> 
> >> All the best...
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> yellowdog-general mailing list -
> yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com
> >> Unsuscribe info:
> >> http://lists.fixstars.com/mailman/listinfo/yellowdog-general
> >> HINT: to Google archives, try  '&lt;keywords>
> site:us.fixstars.com'
> > _______________________________________________
> > yellowdog-general mailing list -
> yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com
> > Unsuscribe info:
> http://lists.fixstars.com/mailman/listinfo/yellowdog-general
> > HINT: to Google archives, try  '&lt;keywords> site:us.fixstars.com'
> 
> _______________________________________________
> yellowdog-general mailing list - yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com
> Unsuscribe info:
> http://lists.fixstars.com/mailman/listinfo/yellowdog-general
> HINT: to Google archives, try  '&lt;keywords> site:us.fixstars.com'

From henry.olders at mcgill.ca  Wed Jul 28 01:07:44 2010
From: henry.olders at mcgill.ca (Henry Olders)
Date: Tue, 27 Jul 2010 12:07:44 -0400
Subject: [ydl-gen] Won't Boot YDL with Power Mac G5 1.6 GHz machine
In-Reply-To: <869349732.655953.1280246243206.JavaMail.root@sz0160a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <869349732.655953.1280246243206.JavaMail.root@sz0160a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <AE45D162-3920-4D84-8A69-29EBD84F4C84@mcgill.ca>

yes.
Henry




On 2010-07-27, at 11:57 , Keith wrote:

> Ok. I have two HDD's in my PPC system. Can I have one HDD formatted in ext2/3/4 and leave the other formatted for Mac OS X?
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Best Regards, Keith 
> http://home.comcast.net/~kilowattradio/
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> 
>> From: "Henry Olders" <henry.olders at mcgill.ca>
>> To: "Discussion List for Yellow Dog Linux User Topics" <yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com>
>> Sent: Tuesday, July 27, 2010 7:49:32 AM
>> Subject: Re: [ydl-gen] Won't Boot YDL with Power Mac G5 1.6 GHz machine
>> 
>> http://www.yellowdoglinux.com/support/installation/ydl6.2_apple_guide.pdf
>> 
>> page 4 says you need to partition a single drive into at least 2
>> partitions. Mac OS includes disk utility which does a destructive
>> partition. If you need "live" partitioning, google for a 3rd party
>> tool such as iPartition .
>> 
>> Henry
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On 2010-07-27, at 10:29 , Keith wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi, I have done all the hash checksums and all the checksums are
>> correct.
>>> 
>>>> Keith, did you remember to partition your internal drive so that it
>> is
>>>> formatted for Linux? 
>>> 
>>> Well I can't partition it for ext2/3/4 unless I can boot up the DVD.
>> On a Intel machine I could use partition magic,
>>> but what do I use for a PPC running Mac OS X? Do I have to only have
>> a linux partition on the PPC or can OS X & YDL co-exists?
>>> This is my 1st attempt to install on PPC after many Intel installs
>> of Linux so a *Good* web page would be appreciated.
>>> 
>>> TIA.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> Best Regards, Keith 
>>> http://home.comcast.net/~kilowattradio/
>>> 
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> 
>>>> From: "Derick Centeno" <dcenteno at ydl.net>
>>>> To: yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, July 27, 2010 6:11:18 AM
>>>> Subject: Re: [ydl-gen] Won't Boot YDL with Power Mac G5 1.6 GHz
>> machine
>>>> 
>>>> On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 17:37:52 -0700
>>>> Keith <kilowattradio at comcast.net> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> I'm having a problem booting any Yellow Dog Linux for PPC with my
>>>>> Power Mac PPC w 1.6 GHz processor. If I put in a Mac Disk and
>> hold
>>>>> down the C on the keyboard Mac OS X PPC disks boots fine. If I
>> put
>>>> in
>>>>> any YDL DVD in the drive the YDL PPC DVD will not boot and the
>>>>> machine Boots Mac OS X Tiger from the HDD.
>>>>> I have also burned the YDL DVD at slowest speeds and on different
>>>> DVD
>>>>> burners with the same result.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Anyone know what I should check or do to get YDL PPC DVD to boot?
>>>>> -- 
>>>>> Best Regards, Keith
>>>>> http://home.comcast.net/~kilowattradio/
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Keith, did you remember to partition your internal drive so that it
>> is
>>>> formatted for Linux?  Also did you bother to test whether the
>> SHA1SUM
>>>> for the .iso image of YDL 6.2 you downloaded matches the official
>>>> SHA1SUM value before you burned the DVD?
>>>> 
>>>> If you did not do this test and/or the SHA1SUM value do not match
>> then
>>>> the .iso image of YDL you burned onto your DVD is incomplete and
>> will
>>>> not have all the information it needs to properly install YDL onto
>>>> your
>>>> system.
>>>> 
>>>> Please note it is not the speed of the burn that matters; but
>> whether
>>>> the SHA1SUM values match.
>>>> 
>>>> In downloading the .iso it is best and most efficient to have DSL
>> or
>>>> faster internet connections.  If your DSL speed is low the download
>> of
>>>> the YDL .iso will take hours.  However, if you only have dial-up
>>>> speeds
>>>> (56K modem or slower) the full download of YDL will require a week
>> or
>>>> longer with one phone line dedicated to doing nothing but that
>>>> download
>>>> without any disconnnects; of course any disturbance on such a line
>>>> means starting from scratch all over again.
>>>> 
>>>> All the best...
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> yellowdog-general mailing list -
>> yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com
>>>> Unsuscribe info:
>>>> http://lists.fixstars.com/mailman/listinfo/yellowdog-general
>>>> HINT: to Google archives, try  '&lt;keywords>
>> site:us.fixstars.com'
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> yellowdog-general mailing list -
>> yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com
>>> Unsuscribe info:
>> http://lists.fixstars.com/mailman/listinfo/yellowdog-general
>>> HINT: to Google archives, try  '&lt;keywords> site:us.fixstars.com'
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> yellowdog-general mailing list - yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com
>> Unsuscribe info:
>> http://lists.fixstars.com/mailman/listinfo/yellowdog-general
>> HINT: to Google archives, try  '&lt;keywords> site:us.fixstars.com'
> _______________________________________________
> yellowdog-general mailing list - yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com
> Unsuscribe info: http://lists.fixstars.com/mailman/listinfo/yellowdog-general
> HINT: to Google archives, try  '&lt;keywords> site:us.fixstars.com'


From kilowattradio at comcast.net  Wed Jul 28 01:07:29 2010
From: kilowattradio at comcast.net (Keith)
Date: Tue, 27 Jul 2010 16:07:29 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [ydl-gen] Won't Boot YDL with Power Mac G5 1.6 GHz machine
In-Reply-To: <869349732.655953.1280246243206.JavaMail.root@sz0160a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <826469559.656678.1280246849615.JavaMail.root@sz0160a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>


OK I have YDL up & running and I am printing the manual. Thanks for the pointers!
:-)

-- 
Best Regards, Keith 
http://home.comcast.net/~kilowattradio/

----- Original Message -----

> From: "Keith" <kilowattradio at comcast.net>
> To: "Discussion List for Yellow Dog Linux User Topics" <yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, July 27, 2010 8:57:23 AM
> Subject: Re: [ydl-gen] Won't Boot YDL with Power Mac G5 1.6 GHz machine
> 
> Ok. I have two HDD's in my PPC system. Can I have one HDD formatted in
> ext2/3/4 and leave the other formatted for Mac OS X?
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Best Regards, Keith 
> http://home.comcast.net/~kilowattradio/
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> 
> > From: "Henry Olders" <henry.olders at mcgill.ca>
> > To: "Discussion List for Yellow Dog Linux User Topics"
> <yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com>
> > Sent: Tuesday, July 27, 2010 7:49:32 AM
> > Subject: Re: [ydl-gen] Won't Boot YDL with Power Mac G5 1.6 GHz
> machine
> > 
> >
> http://www.yellowdoglinux.com/support/installation/ydl6.2_apple_guide.pdf
> > 
> > page 4 says you need to partition a single drive into at least 2
> > partitions. Mac OS includes disk utility which does a destructive
> > partition. If you need "live" partitioning, google for a 3rd party
> > tool such as iPartition .
> > 
> > Henry
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > On 2010-07-27, at 10:29 , Keith wrote:
> > 
> > > Hi, I have done all the hash checksums and all the checksums are
> > correct.
> > > 
> > >> Keith, did you remember to partition your internal drive so that
> it
> > is
> > >> formatted for Linux? 
> > > 
> > > Well I can't partition it for ext2/3/4 unless I can boot up the
> DVD.
> > On a Intel machine I could use partition magic,
> > > but what do I use for a PPC running Mac OS X? Do I have to only
> have
> > a linux partition on the PPC or can OS X & YDL co-exists?
> > > This is my 1st attempt to install on PPC after many Intel
> installs
> > of Linux so a *Good* web page would be appreciated.
> > > 
> > > TIA.
> > > 
> > > 
> > > -- 
> > > Best Regards, Keith 
> > > http://home.comcast.net/~kilowattradio/
> > > 
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > 
> > >> From: "Derick Centeno" <dcenteno at ydl.net>
> > >> To: yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com
> > >> Sent: Tuesday, July 27, 2010 6:11:18 AM
> > >> Subject: Re: [ydl-gen] Won't Boot YDL with Power Mac G5 1.6 GHz
> > machine
> > >> 
> > >> On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 17:37:52 -0700
> > >> Keith <kilowattradio at comcast.net> wrote:
> > >> 
> > >>> I'm having a problem booting any Yellow Dog Linux for PPC with
> my
> > >>> Power Mac PPC w 1.6 GHz processor. If I put in a Mac Disk and
> > hold
> > >>> down the C on the keyboard Mac OS X PPC disks boots fine. If I
> > put
> > >> in
> > >>> any YDL DVD in the drive the YDL PPC DVD will not boot and the
> > >>> machine Boots Mac OS X Tiger from the HDD.
> > >>> I have also burned the YDL DVD at slowest speeds and on
> different
> > >> DVD
> > >>> burners with the same result.
> > >>> 
> > >>> Anyone know what I should check or do to get YDL PPC DVD to
> boot?
> > >>> -- 
> > >>> Best Regards, Keith
> > >>> http://home.comcast.net/~kilowattradio/
> > >>> 
> > >> 
> > >> Keith, did you remember to partition your internal drive so that
> it
> > is
> > >> formatted for Linux?  Also did you bother to test whether the
> > SHA1SUM
> > >> for the .iso image of YDL 6.2 you downloaded matches the
> official
> > >> SHA1SUM value before you burned the DVD?
> > >> 
> > >> If you did not do this test and/or the SHA1SUM value do not
> match
> > then
> > >> the .iso image of YDL you burned onto your DVD is incomplete and
> > will
> > >> not have all the information it needs to properly install YDL
> onto
> > >> your
> > >> system.
> > >> 
> > >> Please note it is not the speed of the burn that matters; but
> > whether
> > >> the SHA1SUM values match.
> > >> 
> > >> In downloading the .iso it is best and most efficient to have
> DSL
> > or
> > >> faster internet connections.  If your DSL speed is low the
> download
> > of
> > >> the YDL .iso will take hours.  However, if you only have dial-up
> > >> speeds
> > >> (56K modem or slower) the full download of YDL will require a
> week
> > or
> > >> longer with one phone line dedicated to doing nothing but that
> > >> download
> > >> without any disconnnects; of course any disturbance on such a
> line
> > >> means starting from scratch all over again.
> > >> 
> > >> All the best...
> > >> _______________________________________________
> > >> yellowdog-general mailing list -
> > yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com
> > >> Unsuscribe info:
> > >> http://lists.fixstars.com/mailman/listinfo/yellowdog-general
> > >> HINT: to Google archives, try  '&lt;keywords>
> > site:us.fixstars.com'
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > yellowdog-general mailing list -
> > yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com
> > > Unsuscribe info:
> > http://lists.fixstars.com/mailman/listinfo/yellowdog-general
> > > HINT: to Google archives, try  '&lt;keywords>
> site:us.fixstars.com'
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > yellowdog-general mailing list -
> yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com
> > Unsuscribe info:
> > http://lists.fixstars.com/mailman/listinfo/yellowdog-general
> > HINT: to Google archives, try  '&lt;keywords> site:us.fixstars.com'
> _______________________________________________
> yellowdog-general mailing list - yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com
> Unsuscribe info:
> http://lists.fixstars.com/mailman/listinfo/yellowdog-general
> HINT: to Google archives, try  '&lt;keywords> site:us.fixstars.com'

From pjwall at mac.com  Thu Jul 29 01:49:32 2010
From: pjwall at mac.com (Pat Wall)
Date: Wed, 28 Jul 2010 17:49:32 +0100
Subject: [ydl-gen] Building Firefox 4.0 under YDL 6.2 PPC
In-Reply-To: <20100727090021.10d6625b@arakus>
References: <20100726203448.3a16f36e@powerstation.ydl>
	<20100727090021.10d6625b@arakus>
Message-ID: <20100728174932.45124b1b@powerstation.ydl>

On Tue, 27 Jul 2010 09:00:21 -0400
Derick Centeno <dcenteno at ydl.net> wrote:

> On Mon, 26 Jul 2010 20:34:48 +0100
> Pat Wall <pjwall at mac.com> wrote:
> 
> > Hi All
> > 
> > I was wondering if anyone has tried building Firefox 4.0 beta or
> > from the latest source tree?
> > 
> > For me the build fails with an architecture support error for ycbcr
> > which has been added to Firefox from Chromium code:
> > 
> > "/home/pjwall/src/mozilla-central/gfx/ycbcr/chromium_types.h:76:2:
> > error: #error Please add support for your architecture in
> > chromium_types.h"
> > 

Hi Derick!

> > 
> 
> Hi Pat:
> 
> The fastest and least time consuming option you may have is to comment
> out the offending code.

It turns out that a bug has already been filed in relation to the error.
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=576764#c1

chromium_types.h defines "_ppc_" as lowercase when in fact it should be
uppercase "_PPC_" or "_powerpc_" I changed the #define in the file to
read "_PPC_" and it buit successfully as described by the submitter -

Happy Days :-)

> 
> The other possibility is to rewrite chromium_types.h so that it
> references PPC recognized commands which also means that you may have
> to become (or be) very familiar with PPC assembler and/or the PPC
> command architecture controlling various aspects of the PPC cpu. The
> problem with that is that you could make the new file so specific to
> the PPC you own that the code may not function on other PPC systems
> differently designed.

I'm afraid PPC assembler is way beyond my reach :-) Thankfully it
appears to be small bug as such with a simple fix.

Thanks again


Pat

From dcenteno at ydl.net  Thu Jul 29 09:06:43 2010
From: dcenteno at ydl.net (Derick Centeno)
Date: Wed, 28 Jul 2010 20:06:43 -0400
Subject: [ydl-gen] Building Firefox 4.0 under YDL 6.2 PPC
In-Reply-To: <4C4EF823.7050108@ieee.org>
References: <20100726203448.3a16f36e@powerstation.ydl>
	<20100727090021.10d6625b@arakus>	<4C4EF823.7050108@ieee.org>
Message-ID: <20100728200643.2c9cd062@arakus>

On Tue, 27 Jul 2010 08:15:47 -0700
Terence G Christopher <t.g.christopher at ieee.org> wrote:

> Having installed YDL on my play station 3m and then having tried and 
> failed to install my wireless keyboard, I have been following the 
> various messages that have developed  over the past 6 months.It is a 
> great pity that the incompleteness of YDL and lack of readily
> accessible documentation together with the failure of Sony to permit
> the machine to be readily used and switch between operating systems
> should destroy what could have been a fascinating and enriching
> engineering development, It is disheartening to see discussions that
> are unchanged from 30 years ago which to me show that all of the talk
> about object oriented code, and clean interfaces was just that talk.I
> realise that the increasing complexity of machines and programmes
> greatly increases the challenges, however Many people such as myself
> do not want to spend our lives fiddling trying to get commonly used
> software to work on a machine. It is to me a measure of the
> inadequacy of the development and support operation. This discourages
> me from even attempting to use the machine. So no my play station
> is merely an expensive and clumsy blue ray player. What a pity.
> sincerely
> Terence Christopher

Hi Terrance:

It may be of some interest that if you are interested in continuing to
run your PS3 with YDL and sacrificing the ability to participate with
Sony's current vision for the PS3 you could refer to the YDL Board at
http://yellowdog-board.com/

Although I do believe that the YDL Board was focused on supporting the
PS3, you may pick up some ideas with others regarding what solutions
remain or exist.  Some members have taken action and pursued legal
action against Sony; I'm not sure that would interest you but there are
other threads and topics which may.  Two threads covering
a variety of topics include:

http://yellowdog-board.com/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=7266

http://yellowdog-board.com/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=7545

I really wish that I had something more positive to report in regards
to the PS3 but I can say that the YDL Board is well administered by
persons well versed in the PS3 and the admins there could be useful.
It is possible you may find solutions which are difficult to find
elsewhere which would allow you to continue your research effort.

As for the incompleteness of YDL, surely you are aware that both Terra
Soft Solutions and later Fixstars were always at a disadvantage as they
were (and in the case of Fixstars still remain) comparatively tiny
companies with finite resources.  Support for the PowerPC was always a
very odd position for any company because the marketplace for
everything supporting that CPU was always small; few know for instance
that Linus Torvalds, the creator of Linux, really thought that Linux
for the PowerPC was a losing proposition; his actual comment was
actually much harsher. For TSS and later Fixstars to make something out
of an essentially non-existent marketplace is an amazing accomplishment.

Having expressed the above the discussion as I'm sure you are aware is
academic.  IBM announced last year in an article published by Ars
Technica that they were ceasing production on the Cell and moving
onwards towards utilizing what they've learned from working with the
Cell by applying techniques developed for it to be implemented with
hybridized multicore chips developed by Intel which have begun to hit
the marketplace already.  These new systems are not only multicore but
a few systems developed by AMD for instance are CPU/GPU hybrids as well.

I discussed the details and refered to the various articles within the
YDL Board.  There is another technological issue which spelled the end
of PowerPC development as it has existed in the past.  Fixstars
formally announced that YDL 6.2 is the last version of YDL to be
developed for PowerPC systems.  Fixstars has moved YDL and all other
products to be supporting Intel compatibles only. Although
Fixstars does continue to support PowerPC systems these services are
all fee based contractual services.

The only free current version of YDL which exists is YDL with CUDA
which only runs on Intel compatibles.

Now we can swim down memory lane or move forward with the scientific
and market realities such as they are.  As you are already probably
aware there exist hexacore hybridized CPU/GPU systems that are laptops
-- the Cell never developed that far.  Depending on who you listen to
either an interesting age of technical development is over or moving
forward.

All the best...

From t.g.christopher at ieee.org  Thu Jul 29 11:00:01 2010
From: t.g.christopher at ieee.org (Terence G Christopher)
Date: Wed, 28 Jul 2010 19:00:01 -0700
Subject: [ydl-gen] Building Firefox 4.0 under YDL 6.2 PPC
In-Reply-To: <20100728200643.2c9cd062@arakus>
References: <20100726203448.3a16f36e@powerstation.ydl>	<20100727090021.10d6625b@arakus>	<4C4EF823.7050108@ieee.org>
	<20100728200643.2c9cd062@arakus>
Message-ID: <4C50E0A1.1090506@ieee.org>

Yes I realise that it is over before it even started. Clearly the Blade 
is an unusual machine though it has been extensively used outside of the 
PS3. I believe that IBM is collaborating with Intel..Does that mean the 
the blade has also come to the end of its development as an independent 
machine?
I do not know the architecture of the new Intel machines, do they 
provide multiple high speed memories or caches depending on how you look 
at them with a main control unit? Do they compete well with blade 
processors? I just don't know where the field is going... Everything I 
read speaks of greater and greater parallelism. Is that correct? Are the 
new hexacore machines developing in the direction of the blade? How do 
they offer architectural advantages. Any reference sources would be 
interesting.
If that is the case then YDL for that would be interesting too.  
Certainly anything out of Sony's reach
Thanks
Graham

On 7/28/2010 5:06 PM, Derick Centeno wrote:
> On Tue, 27 Jul 2010 08:15:47 -0700
> Terence G Christopher<t.g.christopher at ieee.org>  wrote:
>
>    
>> Having installed YDL on my play station 3m and then having tried and
>> failed to install my wireless keyboard, I have been following the
>> various messages that have developed  over the past 6 months.It is a
>> great pity that the incompleteness of YDL and lack of readily
>> accessible documentation together with the failure of Sony to permit
>> the machine to be readily used and switch between operating systems
>> should destroy what could have been a fascinating and enriching
>> engineering development, It is disheartening to see discussions that
>> are unchanged from 30 years ago which to me show that all of the talk
>> about object oriented code, and clean interfaces was just that talk.I
>> realise that the increasing complexity of machines and programmes
>> greatly increases the challenges, however Many people such as myself
>> do not want to spend our lives fiddling trying to get commonly used
>> software to work on a machine. It is to me a measure of the
>> inadequacy of the development and support operation. This discourages
>> me from even attempting to use the machine. So no my play station
>> is merely an expensive and clumsy blue ray player. What a pity.
>> sincerely
>> Terence Christopher
>>      
> Hi Terrance:
>
> It may be of some interest that if you are interested in continuing to
> run your PS3 with YDL and sacrificing the ability to participate with
> Sony's current vision for the PS3 you could refer to the YDL Board at
> http://yellowdog-board.com/
>
> Although I do believe that the YDL Board was focused on supporting the
> PS3, you may pick up some ideas with others regarding what solutions
> remain or exist.  Some members have taken action and pursued legal
> action against Sony; I'm not sure that would interest you but there are
> other threads and topics which may.  Two threads covering
> a variety of topics include:
>
> http://yellowdog-board.com/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=7266
>
> http://yellowdog-board.com/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=7545
>
> I really wish that I had something more positive to report in regards
> to the PS3 but I can say that the YDL Board is well administered by
> persons well versed in the PS3 and the admins there could be useful.
> It is possible you may find solutions which are difficult to find
> elsewhere which would allow you to continue your research effort.
>
> As for the incompleteness of YDL, surely you are aware that both Terra
> Soft Solutions and later Fixstars were always at a disadvantage as they
> were (and in the case of Fixstars still remain) comparatively tiny
> companies with finite resources.  Support for the PowerPC was always a
> very odd position for any company because the marketplace for
> everything supporting that CPU was always small; few know for instance
> that Linus Torvalds, the creator of Linux, really thought that Linux
> for the PowerPC was a losing proposition; his actual comment was
> actually much harsher. For TSS and later Fixstars to make something out
> of an essentially non-existent marketplace is an amazing accomplishment.
>
> Having expressed the above the discussion as I'm sure you are aware is
> academic.  IBM announced last year in an article published by Ars
> Technica that they were ceasing production on the Cell and moving
> onwards towards utilizing what they've learned from working with the
> Cell by applying techniques developed for it to be implemented with
> hybridized multicore chips developed by Intel which have begun to hit
> the marketplace already.  These new systems are not only multicore but
> a few systems developed by AMD for instance are CPU/GPU hybrids as well.
>
> I discussed the details and refered to the various articles within the
> YDL Board.  There is another technological issue which spelled the end
> of PowerPC development as it has existed in the past.  Fixstars
> formally announced that YDL 6.2 is the last version of YDL to be
> developed for PowerPC systems.  Fixstars has moved YDL and all other
> products to be supporting Intel compatibles only. Although
> Fixstars does continue to support PowerPC systems these services are
> all fee based contractual services.
>
> The only free current version of YDL which exists is YDL with CUDA
> which only runs on Intel compatibles.
>
> Now we can swim down memory lane or move forward with the scientific
> and market realities such as they are.  As you are already probably
> aware there exist hexacore hybridized CPU/GPU systems that are laptops
> -- the Cell never developed that far.  Depending on who you listen to
> either an interesting age of technical development is over or moving
> forward.
>
> All the best...
> _______________________________________________
> yellowdog-general mailing list - yellowdog-general at lists.fixstars.com
> Unsuscribe info: http://lists.fixstars.com/mailman/listinfo/yellowdog-general
> HINT: to Google archives, try  '&lt;keywords>  site:us.fixstars.com'
>
>    

From dcenteno at ydl.net  Thu Jul 29 12:58:41 2010
From: dcenteno at ydl.net (Derick Centeno)
Date: Wed, 28 Jul 2010 23:58:41 -0400
Subject: [ydl-gen] Building Firefox 4.0 under YDL 6.2 PPC
In-Reply-To: <4C50E0A1.1090506@ieee.org>
References: <20100726203448.3a16f36e@powerstation.ydl>
	<20100727090021.10d6625b@arakus>	<4C4EF823.7050108@ieee.org>
	<20100728200643.2c9cd062@arakus>	<4C50E0A1.1090506@ieee.org>
Message-ID: <20100728235841.6560f63a@arakus>

On Wed, 28 Jul 2010 19:00:01 -0700
Terence G Christopher <t.g.christopher at ieee.org> wrote:

> Yes I realise that it is over before it even started. Clearly the
> Blade is an unusual machine though it has been extensively used
> outside of the PS3. I believe that IBM is collaborating with
> Intel..Does that mean the the blade has also come to the end of its
> development as an independent machine?
> I do not know the architecture of the new Intel machines, do they 
> provide multiple high speed memories or caches depending on how you
> look at them with a main control unit? Do they compete well with
> blade processors? I just don't know where the field is going...
> Everything I read speaks of greater and greater parallelism. Is that
> correct? Are the new hexacore machines developing in the direction of
> the blade? How do they offer architectural advantages. Any reference
> sources would be interesting.
> If that is the case then YDL for that would be interesting too.  
> Certainly anything out of Sony's reach
> Thanks
> Graham
> 
> On 7/28/2010 5:06 PM, Derick Centeno wrote:
> >>      
> > Hi Terrance:
> >
> > It may be of some interest that if you are interested in continuing
> > to run your PS3 with YDL and sacrificing the ability to participate
> > with Sony's current vision for the PS3 you could refer to the YDL
> > Board at http://yellowdog-board.com/
> >
> > Although I do believe that the YDL Board was focused on supporting
> > the PS3, you may pick up some ideas with others regarding what
> > solutions remain or exist.  Some members have taken action and
> > pursued legal action against Sony; I'm not sure that would interest
> > you but there are other threads and topics which may.  Two threads
> > covering a variety of topics include:
> >
> > http://yellowdog-board.com/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=7266
> >
> > http://yellowdog-board.com/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=7545
> >
> > I really wish that I had something more positive to report in
> > regards to the PS3 but I can say that the YDL Board is well
> > administered by persons well versed in the PS3 and the admins there
> > could be useful. It is possible you may find solutions which are
> > difficult to find elsewhere which would allow you to continue your
> > research effort.
> >
> > As for the incompleteness of YDL, surely you are aware that both
> > Terra Soft Solutions and later Fixstars were always at a
> > disadvantage as they were (and in the case of Fixstars still
> > remain) comparatively tiny companies with finite resources.
> > Support for the PowerPC was always a very odd position for any
> > company because the marketplace for everything supporting that CPU
> > was always small; few know for instance that Linus Torvalds, the
> > creator of Linux, really thought that Linux for the PowerPC was a
> > losing proposition; his actual comment was actually much harsher.
> > For TSS and later Fixstars to make something out of an essentially
> > non-existent marketplace is an amazing accomplishment.
> >
> > Having expressed the above the discussion as I'm sure you are aware
> > is academic.  IBM announced last year in an article published by Ars
> > Technica that they were ceasing production on the Cell and moving
> > onwards towards utilizing what they've learned from working with the
> > Cell by applying techniques developed for it to be implemented with
> > hybridized multicore chips developed by Intel which have begun to
> > hit the marketplace already.  These new systems are not only
> > multicore but a few systems developed by AMD for instance are
> > CPU/GPU hybrids as well.
> >
> > I discussed the details and refered to the various articles within
> > the YDL Board.  There is another technological issue which spelled
> > the end of PowerPC development as it has existed in the past.
> > Fixstars formally announced that YDL 6.2 is the last version of YDL
> > to be developed for PowerPC systems.  Fixstars has moved YDL and
> > all other products to be supporting Intel compatibles only. Although
> > Fixstars does continue to support PowerPC systems these services are
> > all fee based contractual services.
> >
> > The only free current version of YDL which exists is YDL with CUDA
> > which only runs on Intel compatibles.
> >
> > Now we can swim down memory lane or move forward with the scientific
> > and market realities such as they are.  As you are already probably
> > aware there exist hexacore hybridized CPU/GPU systems that are
> > laptops -- the Cell never developed that far.  Depending on who you
> > listen to either an interesting age of technical development is
> > over or moving forward.
> >
> > All the best...

There are two articles I came across which may address aspects of a few
of the questions you raised but not at the level of detail or direction
perhaps which may really interest you.  They are here:

http://www.pcper.com/article.php?aid=883

http://www.kokeytechnology.com/internet-technology/amd-llano-hybrid-cpugpu-processor-vs-intel-atom-processor%E2%80%99s-hold-on-laptops-and-netbooks/

I'm exploring reliable references really carefully before I lay out any
cash; having said that it is interesting that Fixstars offers YDL for
CUDA for free and if you reference their Japanese pages it is clear
that they've moved YDL into the x_86 Linux family.  Also support for
CUDA (Nvidia) and ATI's GPU via OpenCL is available with YDL for CUDA.

If your interest remains with the Blades check out what Fixstars offers
you'll be surprised what contracts and services they continue
supporting.  Of course, for most persons this level of discussion is
more than most can follow.

Given the reality that what is useful for one could be meaningless for
another I don't want to suggest that everything is resolved.  I did
want to convey however that if one is looking both in a forward and
practical direction what Fixstars offers -- especially YDL for CUDA --
as a free product can be compelling for the interested individual.

Parallelism remains a challenge however it appears from the articles
that the manner of how it is implemented is more efficient in the new
designs than what existed in the Cell or other PowerPC systems.

By the way here's a tip to decipher whatever Fixstars actually means as
it's headquarters are in Japan (by which I mean, their English pages
don't accurately convey what is going on with their products,
unfortunately).  Access the Fixstars Japanese website directly then
have the entire page processed via Google Translate.  Viola!!

Sensible and meaningful English which one can then use to get answers
from Fixstars more intelligently should you decide to query them
directly.

Good Luck...

From ac7xc1nx at comcast.net  Fri Jul 30 12:59:36 2010
From: ac7xc1nx at comcast.net (Keith)
Date: Thu, 29 Jul 2010 20:59:36 -0700
Subject: [ydl-gen] Booting YDL 6.2
Message-ID: <1280462376.4980.5.camel@localhost.localdomain>

 When I boot up YDL on a system with MAC OS X There is a very short
delay when the initial boot menu for Linux, Mac OS X & CDROM. I would
like to lengthen to the amount of time this menu is displayed to about
one minute. How do I change the time delay?
 I have looked at /boot/etc/yaboot.conf but this file seems to deal with
the second boot menu after the initial one is displayed.


TIA,

Keith



From ppc.addon at gmail.com  Fri Jul 30 18:39:30 2010
From: ppc.addon at gmail.com (nello martuscielli)
Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2010 11:39:30 +0200
Subject: [ydl-gen] Booting YDL 6.2
In-Reply-To: <1280462376.4980.5.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <1280462376.4980.5.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=ckTLcV7XX75YzZtsgN5cNFmtgkikLkVyjPtr5@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Jul 30, 2010 at 5:59 AM, Keith <ac7xc1nx at comcast.net> wrote:

> ?I have looked at /boot/etc/yaboot.conf but this file seems to deal with
> the second boot menu after the initial one is displayed.
>
>

## delay is the amount of time in seconds the dual boot menu (if one
## is configured, by the presense of macos, macosx, etc options here)
## will wait before choosing the default OS (GNU/Linux or the value of
## defaultos=).  If you omit this then the value of timeout=
## (converted to seconds) will be used.

delay=10

## timeout is the amount of time in tenths of a second that yaboot
## will wait before booting the default kernel image (the first image=
## section in this config file or the value of default=).

timeout=40



regards
--
Power Mac G4 AGP 450MHz - CRUX PPC (32bit)/YDL

From ac7xc1nx at comcast.net  Sat Jul 31 00:27:00 2010
From: ac7xc1nx at comcast.net (Keith)
Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2010 08:27:00 -0700
Subject: [ydl-gen] Booting YDL 6.2
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTi=ckTLcV7XX75YzZtsgN5cNFmtgkikLkVyjPtr5@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1280462376.4980.5.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<AANLkTi=ckTLcV7XX75YzZtsgN5cNFmtgkikLkVyjPtr5@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1280503620.5026.3.camel@localhost.localdomain>


On Fri, 2010-07-30 at 11:39 +0200, nello martuscielli wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 30, 2010 at 5:59 AM, Keith <ac7xc1nx at comcast.net> wrote:
> 
> >  I have looked at /boot/etc/yaboot.conf but this file seems to deal with
> > the second boot menu after the initial one is displayed.
> >
> >
> 
> ## delay is the amount of time in seconds the dual boot menu (if one
> ## is configured, by the presense of macos, macosx, etc options here)
> ## will wait before choosing the default OS (GNU/Linux or the value of
> ## defaultos=).  If you omit this then the value of timeout=
> ## (converted to seconds) will be used.
> 
> delay=10
> 
> ## timeout is the amount of time in tenths of a second that yaboot
> ## will wait before booting the default kernel image (the first image=
> ## section in this config file or the value of default=).
> 
> timeout=40
> 
> 
> 
> regards
> --
> Power Mac G4 AGP 450MHz - CRUX PPC (32bit)/YDL

I went into /boot/etc/yaboot.conf
and set up yaboot with these delay & timeout settings 
and the boot menu times are the exact same as before. Am I modifying the
wrong file?

partition=3
timeout=600
## 600 / 10 = 60
install=/usr/lib/yaboot/yaboot
delay=60
enablecdboot
enableofboot
enablenetboot
macosx=/dev/sda3
magicboot=/usr/lib/yaboot/ofboot





From billfink at mindspring.com  Sat Jul 31 09:47:16 2010
From: billfink at mindspring.com (Bill Fink)
Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2010 20:47:16 -0400
Subject: [ydl-gen] Booting YDL 6.2
In-Reply-To: <1280503620.5026.3.camel@localhost.localdomain>
References: <1280462376.4980.5.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<AANLkTi=ckTLcV7XX75YzZtsgN5cNFmtgkikLkVyjPtr5@mail.gmail.com>
	<1280503620.5026.3.camel@localhost.localdomain>
Message-ID: <20100730204716.46c34ea3.billfink@mindspring.com>

On Fri, 30 Jul 2010, Keith wrote:

> On Fri, 2010-07-30 at 11:39 +0200, nello martuscielli wrote:
> > On Fri, Jul 30, 2010 at 5:59 AM, Keith <ac7xc1nx at comcast.net> wrote:
> > 
> > >  I have looked at /boot/etc/yaboot.conf but this file seems to deal with
> > > the second boot menu after the initial one is displayed.
> > >
> > >
> > 
> > ## delay is the amount of time in seconds the dual boot menu (if one
> > ## is configured, by the presense of macos, macosx, etc options here)
> > ## will wait before choosing the default OS (GNU/Linux or the value of
> > ## defaultos=).  If you omit this then the value of timeout=
> > ## (converted to seconds) will be used.
> > 
> > delay=10
> > 
> > ## timeout is the amount of time in tenths of a second that yaboot
> > ## will wait before booting the default kernel image (the first image=
> > ## section in this config file or the value of default=).
> > 
> > timeout=40
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > regards
> > --
> > Power Mac G4 AGP 450MHz - CRUX PPC (32bit)/YDL
> 
> I went into /boot/etc/yaboot.conf
> and set up yaboot with these delay & timeout settings 
> and the boot menu times are the exact same as before. Am I modifying the
> wrong file?
> 
> partition=3
> timeout=600
> ## 600 / 10 = 60
> install=/usr/lib/yaboot/yaboot
> delay=60
> enablecdboot
> enableofboot
> enablenetboot
> macosx=/dev/sda3
> magicboot=/usr/lib/yaboot/ofboot

Did you re-run "ybin -v" after making the changes?
This is from memory as I'm no longer running any
YDL systems, but I believe that's the correct
procedure for installing the new yaboot.conf.

				-Bill