[ydl-gen] Question on YDL.net

[Kai Staats]

All,

> It is always a pleasure to get your attention. But its a little
> frustrating to have the question not be answered. Suppose I really do
> want KDE. Or even suppose that whatever I want, i want to be current.
> Will paying for YDL.net help with that?

I will interject here as this thread has become a bit overloaded when the 
answers are simple. As an official voice of TSS, I add some clarification:

1) It is in fact our job to rebuild KDE for YDL, not that of the KDE team.

2) TSS does in fact promote KDE over Gnome in that it is the default desktop 
and is the only desktop discussed in our printed book.

3) The version of KDE shipping with v4.1 is in fact now antiquated.

4) YDL.net does not at this point in time offer a newer version of KDE.

5) TSS does not have plans to update KDE for YDL v4.1. This is due to a 
somewhat complicated web of devel history and delves into the reason YDL v4.1 
shipped as it did. While this has been covered in one or more 
interviews/reviews of v4.1, the quickest summary is that we were caught in a 
hard place last year, trying to maintain binary compat between YDL v4.0 and 
v4.1 for our mission critical customers while upgrading to what would build 
against the mixed FC3, 4, and 5 packages, libraries, and kernel. The result, 
to be honest, was a challenge. We shipped what we did and when we did given 
the best compromise at that time. While v4.1 was (and remains as such) a more 
complete, out-of-the-box OS than FC5 (in terms of support of hw), it does 
fall behind in the version of many packages.

6) We have a beta of YDL v5.0 in-house, built cleanly from FC5. This is 
initially for our OEM BSP customers with plans to release in Q4 of this year.

I hope this provides clarification.

kai


> >>Here's where I am coming from. I installed fedora core 5 on an old
> >>intel machine. I have YDL 4.0 on an old PowerBook. Each is used as
> >>a desktop, meaning desktop applications. For me that is KDE.
> >>
> >>YDL's preferred desktop is KDE, while Fedora's is Gnome.
> >
> >Actually, this is not really so.
>
> Well, my point was that Fedora goes way out of its way to support
> even their non-preferred desktop.
>
> >I'm sympathetic regarding your experience regarding KDE.  You always
> >as I presented above, had the option to switch to Gnome.  I
> >appreciate the musical themes of KDE, but I work seriously in Gnome.
> >I've heard similar complaints from others regarding KDE, I always
> >recommend Gnome.
> >
> >Maybe you consider using Gnome?
>
> Er, I'm a dummy, but not that big a dummy. I've actually spent a lot
> - a whole lot - of energy on this matter. I may as well tell you why
> I prefer KDE.
>
> - you can put the menubar where it belongs, at the top of the screen!
>
> - I like Konqueror over Firefox. I like the notion of a web browser
> being a file browser. I like the synergy between Apple and khtml.
>
> - I like the way the components integrate, for instance its a snap
> for the browser to be integrated within the news aggregator, for the
> advanced text editor to contribute to the word processor, for the
> raster editor to appear in the spreadsheet. The integration of
> applications is just cool (or at least cooler than in Gnome). One
> preference pane for every toolbar of every app? Cool.
>
> - The KDE design philosophy seems levelheaded. The Gnome guys really,
> really made a mistake, a huge one architecturally with all that CORBA
> business, even though it has been discarded now. Now this I know
> something about. I know this, I do.
>
> - I'm disgusted by office suites that emulate Microsoft. If I wanted
> bad user interface, I'd go where bad is done right, to Office. I come
> from a FrameMaker background and am convinced that any useful word
> processor will use the frame metaphor. Its a political thing gutwise,
> but a practical one too regarding document structure. If you want
> good software, you have to support it. Kword. Try it. Everyone
> reading this, try it. I'd be willing to bet this exchange ends up
> with more converts to KDE than the other way.
>
> - In theory, KDE is along the lines of what you praise YDL as in your
> post to Gavin. It isn't a collection of stuff from all over the
> place, Mozilla, OO.org, OMG plus RedHat's business strategy and some
> multimedia guys in another logical corner of the world. KDE is an
> architecture first, then an integrated set of components, then
> applications that when released are guaranteed to work together.
> Isn't this what you touted? Its just philosophically more attractive.
>
> >You do know about tar, downloading and recompiling all sorts of
> >stuff by now so why stick with the old stuff, if your skills allow
> >you to be and remain current.
>
> But I don't. I don't have those skills. I may have to develop them if
> the YDL community forces me. I'm lazy. I'm looking for what the other
> guys have, an easier life. Even quirky PCBSD has a KDE update process.
>
> >>So my question was sorta simple. IF I PAID, using the one means
> >>TerraSoft provides for consumers to be "fresh," will I indeed be?
> >>
> >>Its not an accusation or anything. I'm just trying my best to
> >>actually use YDL.
> >
> >Why pay anything right now.  It appears you need to have some
> >questions addressed, tested and satisfied.
> >It appears to me, that setting Gnome as your preferred desktop could
> >be an answer for you.  Even using Gnome within YDL 4.0 is so much
> >better than KDE.  And even though both KDE and Gnome are improved in
> >YDL 4.1; I remain believing that Gnome remains better than KDE
> >still.  All the programs which work under KDE remain available in
> >Gnome.
> >Try it out, I'm sure you'll feel better.
> >
> >Now since you don't have YDL 4.1 yet, why not consider exploring
> >Gnome in YDL 4.0?  Get the feel of what I'm suggesting and see if
> >your work within YDL can be such that you work in Gnome instead.
> >You can consider other desktops like Enlightenment
> >(enlightenment.org), but see if working with what is already
> >available helps you.
> >
> >Try using Gnome in YDL 4.0 and see if that is a workable solution
> >for you, after that you should be even better and stronger in
> >confidence in moving up to Gnome in YDL 4.1.
>
> If I use Linux at all, I'll use KDE (and Emacs and functional
> programming). Look, we all make our choices, we all have values that
> we want to support. If I go with OS at all, I'll go this way.
>
> My question stands. Is there a way for me to remain current with KDE
> on YDL by paying (or any other means)? Is YDL.net of any use in this
> regard?
>
> Thanks for the attention.
>
> Best, Ted